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Author Topic: Mahouka Koukou no Rettousei vol.01-12+  (Read 520208 times)
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« Reply #7241 on: December 16, 2013, 11:14:15 PM »
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I have a question

quote from vol 12 ch 2

does that mean that honoka or shizuku said something about his abilities to her, something wich she said she wouldn't tell anyone while she was on the helicopter on the war arc?


something more
what does Honoka’s bloodline have to be with Tatsuya's refusal? and what plan is she talking about? that part of the conversation is confusing for me
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DaniPedro
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« Reply #7240 on: December 16, 2013, 07:31:39 PM »
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@k2r2

For a big event like the 9SC, it's not just the students who come to watch it!!!
There are experienced (either in magic, or fervent followers of the event) and knowledgable (at the very least more knowledgable than highschoolers) who follow it, some of them will write papers about the competitions, some will act as commentators, some will be asked their opinion, all that so the average viewer can get a better grasp at what happens in the competition.

These things that you say we find impressive only because we are readers, those things you say we can't comprehend because of the lack of knowledge, there are people in there that give the viewers the required infos, so they can understand what happens better.

His feats as a technician were OVER 9000
The people can't miss Tatsuya's absolute supremacy among the technicians, IMPOSSIBLE!!!

For people related to magic ing, Tatsuya is a rare gem of the highest quality!!!

For people interested in combat magicians, Tatsuya is a skilled magician capable of efficiently using his weak magic to achieve victory

A powerfull magician, heir of one of the 10 masters clans, can't allow himself/herself to lose against someone who isn't part of the 10 masters clan or the 100.
He didn't use some petty magic on him, it's one of his most powerfull non-lethal magic, and Tatsuya defended against it like a boss, and you think it's crappy??? And the worst is that this heir got beaten by a simple amplification magic, it's like Tatsuya pulled "a thousand years of pain" on him!!! He humiliated him by defeating him with a snap of the fingers, and you think it's worthless.
Juumnji asked Tatsuya if he wanted to marry into one of the 10 masters clan house because he did something the shouldn't have happened. The people from the 10 masters clans were quite displeased with that outcome, it's no joke for them, it's not acceptable!!! They are the strongest magicians, a symbol of power, a power that can't lose to some nobody, yet a nobody with weak magic owned a heir of the 10 master clan.
You don't seem to realise what a huge feat it is!! And you know what??? Masaki was so pressured he went over the permited limit of power for offensive magic, meaning that if Tatsuya didn't have auto-regen, Masaki and his team would have been disqualified!! Just imagine, "the heir of the Ichijou couldn't against a nobody magician with weak magic and got disqualified"...
His victory on MC can't have gone unnoticed, especailly among the 10 and the 100

Tatsuya is famous. Every students from other schools knew him. Also some CAD company approach him in the end of competition.
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« Reply #7239 on: December 16, 2013, 06:52:58 PM »
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@k2r2

For a big event like the 9SC, it's not just the students who come to watch it!!!
There are experienced (either in magic, or fervent followers of the event) and knowledgable (at the very least more knowledgable than highschoolers) who follow it, some of them will write papers about the competitions, some will act as commentators, some will be asked their opinion, all that so the average viewer can get a better grasp at what happens in the competition.

These things that you say we find impressive only because we are readers, those things you say we can't comprehend because of the lack of knowledge, there are people in there that give the viewers the required infos, so they can understand what happens better.

His feats as a technician were OVER 9000
The people can't miss Tatsuya's absolute supremacy among the technicians, IMPOSSIBLE!!!

For people related to magic ing, Tatsuya is a rare gem of the highest quality!!!

For people interested in combat magicians, Tatsuya is a skilled magician capable of efficiently using his weak magic to achieve victory

A powerfull magician, heir of one of the 10 masters clans, can't allow himself/herself to lose against someone who isn't part of the 10 masters clan or the 100.
He didn't use some petty magic on him, it's one of his most powerfull non-lethal magic, and Tatsuya defended against it like a boss, and you think it's crappy??? And the worst is that this heir got beaten by a simple amplification magic, it's like Tatsuya pulled "a thousand years of pain" on him!!! He humiliated him by defeating him with a snap of the fingers, and you think it's worthless.
Juumnji asked Tatsuya if he wanted to marry into one of the 10 masters clan house because he did something the shouldn't have happened. The people from the 10 masters clans were quite displeased with that outcome, it's no joke for them, it's not acceptable!!! They are the strongest magicians, a symbol of power, a power that can't lose to some nobody, yet a nobody with weak magic owned a heir of the 10 master clan.
You don't seem to realise what a huge feat it is!! And you know what??? Masaki was so pressured he went over the permited limit of power for offensive magic, meaning that if Tatsuya didn't have auto-regen, Masaki and his team would have been disqualified!! Just imagine, "the heir of the Ichijou couldn't against a nobody magician with weak magic and got disqualified"...
His victory on MC can't have gone unnoticed, especailly among the 10 and the 100
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« Reply #7238 on: December 16, 2013, 06:26:29 PM »
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most things you mention are reader knowledge or/and feats recognized by extreamly small number of people even among magicians ...

i mean i could go case by case with something like: how many people even recognized it as general purpose cad ? It was said that rifle general purpose cads are at least not common. What is more plausible: magic within one system on a specialized common rifle shaped cad or theoretically impossible general purpose system integration on specialy manufactured device ? You only know about this due to miyuki/masaki/suzune explanation ... if it was not mentioned you would probably be still perfectly cool with it rather than point out this as novel inconsistency... and so on but im too lazy

and again how going all out kamikaze for double KO makes you a celebrity ? No matter how you look at it, objectiivly that's desperation move last resort card to play ... pawn sacrafised himself to take out the queen ... thats how every outsider saw it given their respectable position and performance during code ...

... that's just how shallow and short-sighted people are ... i mean you can watch something but can you fully comprehand what you see without appropriate knowledge ? Let say you saw someone High Jump 3m ... you will take that for granted and be cool with it until you read that word record in high jump is 2,45m. Prior to that you won't  know that you actualy saw smth amazing and unheard of ...

Few points that make him be recognizable for those who doesn't not fully comprehend what his contributions are:
- All the players he was responsible for only lost for each other. I don't know about the general crowd, but for players and supporters of 9SC this certainly call a lot of attention;
- About the general purpose cad: the same way Kichijouji and Masaki were discussing with other members about speed shooting result and mentioned the cad, it's unlikely that other 7 schools didn't discuss the result as well and no one at technician team noticed what Tatsuya did;
- In Newcomers Mirage Bat, it was clearly to all how mad engineering he was, it's mentioned the players activation sequence were the same time, but first high players finish it first, the cad performance took all the credits (or Tatsuya), he is even compared with Taurus Silver.
- He wrote the flying sequence in Miyuki cad, and every one became astonished with it.

 About the kamikaze attack:
While there is the luck factor - Tatsuya took two shoots, this make Misaki wavering and created a gap for the victory - his accomplishments cannot be thrown away. He got into Monolith Code's final round, Tatsuya and Misaki started bombarding one another from a 600 meters range (this called attention), and in the end he won in a direct confront against a scion of the Ichijou's family.

Even if he didn't display any powerful magic, his ability in magic execution  cannot be questioned.
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« Reply #7237 on: December 16, 2013, 05:08:52 PM »
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-A technician who fused to supposedly incompatible systems, something which was said to be impossible...That guy who was asked to register a new magic, who devised the "flash bang" strategy. A technician, whose people's CAD he maintened got better at using their magic (it was quite flagrant during fairy dance).
-A nobody magician with low level magic, dual CAD user, owned selected magicians (because you don't send useless magicians to participate in the 9SC), and kept countering/evading Ichijou's magic and in the end KOed him...
-Important part, Elder Kudou, who usually deosn't watch the matchs, came to see his match (people aren't stupid enough to think the old man came to see Ichijou win against an "already defeated team", it's clear he went to see Tatsuya).
-And the 9SC is a broadcasted event!! And he is the brother of the beautifull flying fairy, the ice queen who use one of the greatest ice magic

If all that isn't noteworthy, if people, with all that, didn't take notice of him, an incredible technician a quite able in battle to keep up with people with good magic ability, then something is seriously wrong somewhere!!!

most things you mention are reader knowledge or/and feats recognized by extreamly small number of people even among magicians ...

i mean i could go case by case with something like: how many people even recognized it as general purpose cad ? It was said that rifle general purpose cads are at least not common. What is more plausible: magic within one system on a specialized common rifle shaped cad or theoretically impossible general purpose system integration on specialy manufactured device ? You only know about this due to miyuki/masaki/suzune explanation ... if it was not mentioned you would probably be still perfectly cool with it rather than point out this as novel inconsistency... and so on but im too lazy

and again how going all out kamikaze for double KO makes you a celebrity ? No matter how you look at it, objectiivly that's desperation move last resort card to play ... pawn sacrafised himself to take out the queen ... thats how every outsider saw it given their respectable position and performance during code ...

... that's just how shallow and short-sighted people are ... i mean you can watch something but can you fully comprehand what you see without appropriate knowledge ? Let say you saw someone High Jump 3m ... you will take that for granted and be cool with it until you read that word record in high jump is 2,45m. Prior to that you won't  know that you actualy saw smth amazing and unheard of ...
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« Reply #7236 on: December 16, 2013, 04:12:30 PM »
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I understand your point. But while it's "easy" to keep the family branches in secrecy, it's hard to think they managed to keep both Miya and Maya lost from the other clans attention. They were both direct decedents and could claim the name Yotsuba. So it's very difficult to think that Yotsuba Miya becomes Shiba Miya and just Kudou knows about it.

you can say yotsuba are too good to hide these things, only kudou could find it.

tatsuya is know for the 9schools, specifically for his talent as a technician. of course he won against masaki but not was a easy fight, he won by a tiny difference and using tricks and no power alone. so he's clever and all, but he isnt a powerful magician (at the look of others)

because of the 9schools is created the third course, izumi knows about him, kent smith is drooling for tatsuya, etc.
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« Reply #7235 on: December 16, 2013, 03:39:30 PM »
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For that, If my memory is good, Koichi and Miya were engaged before Miya got abducted (so before Miya got married and bore children), so before the Yotsuba started with their policy of keeping secret concerning their important memebers.
When their engagement got canceled their was no longer any reasons to give him notable news about her (so no news of her getting children, or no news about the identities of the children she got). After what she went through they must have gotten quite secretive especially concerning her!!!

I understand your point. But while it's "easy" to keep the family branches in secrecy, it's hard to think they managed to keep both Miya and Maya lost from the other clans attention. They were both direct decedents and could claim the name Yotsuba. So it's very difficult to think that Yotsuba Miya becomes Shiba Miya and just Kudou knows about it.
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« Reply #7234 on: December 16, 2013, 03:19:18 PM »
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i fail to understand why he was supposed to be famous ... not many people was actualy able to evaluate properly his contribution as a technician and double K.O. he earned in kamikaze mode against masaki does not make him particulary noteworthy. Throughout the event he struggled against his oponents ...Yeah gram vs bias was pretty flashy but from what i remember not many people were able to recognize gram demolition as high level magic and beside that whole event was pretty luckluster on his part. Most people probably thought that masaki pulled his punches too much which backfired him in the face, especialy since that was the whole point of using bias release ... Not to mention main event was far more memorable due to directive to employ phalanx by katsuto ...

-A technician who fused to supposedly incompatible systems, something which was said to be impossible...That guy who was asked to register a new magic, who devised the "flash bang" strategy. A technician, whose people's CAD he maintened got better at using their magic (it was quite flagrant during fairy dance).
-A nobody magician with low level magic, dual CAD user, owned selected magicians (because you don't send useless magicians to participate in the 9SC), and kept countering/evading Ichijou's magic and in the end KOed him...
-Important part, Elder Kudou, who usually deosn't watch the matchs, came to see his match (people aren't stupid enough to think the old man came to see Ichijou win against an "already defeated team", it's clear he went to see Tatsuya).
-And the 9SC is a broadcasted event!! And he is the brother of the beautifull flying fairy, the ice queen who use one of the greatest ice magic

If all that isn't noteworthy, if people, with all that, didn't take notice of him, an incredible technician a quite able in battle to keep up with people with good magic ability, then something is seriously wrong somewhere!!!
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« Reply #7233 on: December 16, 2013, 02:06:05 PM »
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it's true that Tatsuya got famous during the 9SC
i fail to understand why he was supposed to be famous ... not many people was actualy able to evaluate properly his contribution as a technician and double K.O. he earned in kamikaze mode against masaki does not make him particulary noteworthy. Throughout the event he struggled against his oponents ...Yeah gram vs bias was pretty flashy but from what i remember not many people were able to recognize gram demolition as high level magic and beside that whole event was pretty luckluster on his part. Most people probably thought that masaki pulled his punches too much which backfired him in the face, especialy since that was the whole point of using bias release ... Not to mention main event was far more memorable due to directive to employ phalanx by katsuto ...
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« Reply #7232 on: December 16, 2013, 01:53:30 PM »
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Other thing I cannot understand is how Koichi doesn't know about Tatsuya and Miyuki as Yotsuba, since they are Miya's children and he was engaged with Maya...

For that, If my memory is good, Koichi and Miya were engaged before Miya got abducted (so before Miya got married and bore children), so before the Yotsuba started with their policy of keeping secret concerning their important memebers.
When their engagement got canceled their was no longer any reasons to give him notable news about her (so no news of her getting children, or no news about the identities of the children she got). After what she went through they must have gotten quite secretive especially concerning her!!!
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« Reply #7231 on: December 16, 2013, 12:34:42 PM »
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It's too bad Tatsuya cannot use his full powers in public, he could crush everyone else in the events of Speed Shooting, Monolith Code and Icicle Destruction.
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« Reply #7230 on: December 16, 2013, 12:23:18 PM »
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On that note, it's true that Tatsuya got famous during the 9SC
So I'm surprised that Kasumi didn't know about him at all!! Come on, he is the nobody guy who defeated the scion of the Ichijou family from the 10 master clan in a 1 vs 1 shodown!!!
Any children (or grandchildren old enough) from any head family from the 18 biggest families fighting for a place among the 10 should know that (formerly) unknown student with crazy technicals skills that put shame to all other technicians and defeated a successor of the 10.
I don't understant how Kasumi couldn't have known about him or how Shippou could allow himself to underestimate him...
Haaaaa... Somebody please enlight me...

yeah, I don't think this can be explained... He's been acknowledged as a technician only, what about athletic? Izumi just point out his engineering abilities and forgot about Ichijou. Even if the ten families are some way blocking this information, it's hard to believe that no one, in the 100 families, 28 whatever, didn't know about it.

Other thing I cannot understand is how Koichi doesn't know about Tatsuya and Miyuki as Yotsuba, since they are Miya's children and he was engaged with Maya...
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« Reply #7229 on: December 16, 2013, 11:47:05 AM »
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If Tatsuya attracted so much attention in the 9 schools competition, why don't people recognize him when going out shopping etc.?? And i'm tired of those asking tatsuya "Are you maybe Shiba Tatsuya san?" Ofcourse he is!! Why do they even ask!!! It's like when they see an apple, they'll ask "Is that an apple?"

On that note, it's true that Tatsuya got famous during the 9SC
So I'm surprised that Kasumi didn't know about him at all!! Come on, he is the nobody guy who defeated the scion of the Ichijou family from the 10 master clan in a 1 vs 1 shodown!!!
Any children (or grandchildren old enough) from any head family from the 18 biggest families fighting for a place among the 10 should know that (formerly) unknown student with crazy technicals skills that put shame to all other technicians and defeated a successor of the 10.
I don't understant how Kasumi couldn't have known about him or how Shippou could allow himself to underestimate him...
Haaaaa... Somebody please enlight me...
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« Reply #7228 on: December 16, 2013, 08:45:22 AM »
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I don't think there are any, or at least none that I have seen. Dunno about the Honor Student chapter, but Amelia in wonderland is really just
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« Reply #7227 on: December 16, 2013, 07:21:07 AM »
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can anyone point me to the spoiler summaries of volume 5.
The Honour Student's Supplementary Lesson and
Amelia in Wonderland.

I sorta missed it.

thank you.
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« Reply #7226 on: December 16, 2013, 05:27:00 AM »
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If Tatsuya attracted so much attention in the 9 schools competition, why don't people recognize him when going out shopping etc.?? And i'm tired of those asking tatsuya "Are you maybe Shiba Tatsuya san?" Ofcourse he is!! Why do they even ask!!! It's like when they see an apple, they'll ask "Is that an apple?"
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« Reply #7225 on: December 16, 2013, 12:47:32 AM »
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Are you kidding me? It's been emphasised so many times in Mahouka how magicians have shitty rights: weapons of the state, travel restrictions, the amount of experimentation that was carried out on them by government pressure... The Ten Master Clans have great influence in the Japanese magician community, but that's about it. They're not allowed to interfere in politics and other state affairs. If magicians had the freedom to do as they please, people like Suzune and Tatsuya wouldn't be seeking greater rights for mages, right?

Hahaha the Magician is Foolish.

But no, some of the Magician is smart.
Maybe you think only normal Human can be the Prime Minister or President or whatever.

But that's only in the surface.

Heigu can control GAA.

Maya more or less has equal power to Heigu.


Prime minister or president is their puppet to calm down the Humanist.

After I think again,
Magician are stronger, why they should accept and obey order or command from Non-magician ?


Lina can easily eradicate White House.

Tatsuya can easily Eradicate a country.

Even Itsuwa Mio can easily destroy Tokyo ( she can easily move Tokyo's ground water ).


If they're not foolish, I don't know what's the best words to describe them.


Ah but Heigu is smart, he can control GAA.
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« Reply #7224 on: December 16, 2013, 12:39:21 AM »
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So? does that prove him he is powerful? If 3 Jumonji and 2 kazama gang up on him then he's dead!!
Realistically speaking that is not possible right now, but in a situation like that, I believe Tatsuya will not hold back like he usually does. Like what his moniker literally means he was only born with the power to decompose and reconstruct. If a situation like that occurred Tatsuya wouldn't do what he usually doesby hiding his abilities and fighting without killing them, he would probably use aoe decomposition on them. You are only talking about Tatsuya fighting in a battle where he is not actually battling to the death with Tomitsuka, but in a situation like you described there is no way he would die to keep his abilities secret. Unlike most other magicians he cant freely wield his full power and all magic he can use.
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« Reply #7223 on: December 15, 2013, 11:08:26 PM »
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I meant that If someone is going to kill you he has to be in a certain radius, if there is a person that can kill any target anywhere without any possible defense he is a Huge danger. I agree that in close range tatsuya is simply a strong magician, but long range is the best we have seen so far by a long shot.
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« Reply #7222 on: December 15, 2013, 10:36:04 PM »
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Then you come up with a realistic novel.
I'm not the author, so I don't have to.
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« Reply #7221 on: December 15, 2013, 10:11:55 PM »
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Except that will never happen. At least come up with a realistic scenario.
Then you come up with a realistic novel.
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« Reply #7220 on: December 15, 2013, 09:41:12 PM »
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So? does that prove him he is powerful? If 3 Jumonji and 2 kazama gang up on him then he's dead!!

Except that will never happen. At least come up with a realistic scenario.
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« Reply #7219 on: December 15, 2013, 09:26:04 PM »
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Anyway...going against Tatsuya is foolish...Just wait and see him throw off their plans..LOL.

They don't stand a chance that way...after all Tatsuya is a genius. 

Replied: December 15, 2013, 03:42:01 AM
How can anyone kill Tatsuya? They will be killed even before trying ...
Also, Tatsuya doesn't "kill" he literally obliterates them.
Nothing without MB...are you mistaken? I mean...Tatsuya can use [Flash Cast]...It somehow seems that Tatsuya rarely show off all his powers...
So? does that prove him he is powerful? If 3 Jumonji and 2 kazama gang up on him then he's dead!!
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« Reply #7218 on: December 15, 2013, 08:36:32 PM »
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Anyway...going against Tatsuya is foolish...Just wait and see him throw off their plans..LOL.

They don't stand a chance that way...after all Tatsuya is a genius. 

Replied: December 15, 2013, 08:42:01 PM
Tatsuya can kill anyone but everyone can kill Tatsuya. You think too highly of Tatsuya, he is nothing without his MB, even he have a hard time facing tomitsuka 1 on 1.

How can anyone kill Tatsuya? They will be killed even before trying ...
Also, Tatsuya doesn't "kill" he literally obliterates them.
Nothing without MB...are you mistaken? I mean...Tatsuya can use [Flash Cast]...It somehow seems that Tatsuya rarely show off all his powers...
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« Reply #7217 on: December 15, 2013, 08:36:10 PM »
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I can t imagine the highest general ordering maya or kudou to do something for the military the way they want... However it happens with lina and everyone in the usa.

And If the 10 clans found out every one of tatsuya powers they would have to kill him. With elemental sight his magic should have an infinit range and with trident spell he would simply kill anyone anywhere without a way of defense.

Ps. If he doesn t have an infinit range, with the yotsuba resources and his cad genious he just needs to do a third eye but for the trident spell
Tatsuya can kill anyone but everyone can kill Tatsuya. You think too highly of Tatsuya, he is nothing without his MB, even he have a hard time facing tomitsuka 1 on 1.
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« Reply #7216 on: December 15, 2013, 08:10:23 PM »
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Nah that's it.

Weird huuh ?

In Mahouka verse the Structure of Power is weird.
Especially in Japan.

They have the Freedom to do anything they want.

The country can't interfere them huuh ?

Ah maybe that's the reason why HUMANIST hate them.


The more I read, the more I became confuse.
Humanist ?, magicians ?, weapon ?, blaa bllaa blaa.


Are you kidding me? It's been emphasised so many times in Mahouka how magicians have shitty rights: weapons of the state, travel restrictions, the amount of experimentation that was carried out on them by government pressure... The Ten Master Clans have great influence in the Japanese magician community, but that's about it. They're not allowed to interfere in politics and other state affairs. If magicians had the freedom to do as they please, people like Suzune and Tatsuya wouldn't be seeking greater rights for mages, right?
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« Reply #7215 on: December 15, 2013, 07:49:29 PM »
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Lol that is beacause it is a very complex sistem that ends up having lots of flaws.
Wonders why kudou is so afraid it might crumble
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« Reply #7214 on: December 15, 2013, 07:34:14 PM »
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I can t imagine the highest general ordering maya or kudou to do something for the military the way they want... However it happens with lina and everyone in the usa.

Nah that's it.

Weird huuh ?

In Mahouka verse the Structure of Power is weird.
Especially in Japan.

They have the Freedom to do anything they want.

The country can't interfere them huuh ?

Ah maybe that's the reason why HUMANIST hate them.


The more I read, the more I became confuse.
Humanist ?, magicians ?, weapon ?, blaa bllaa blaa.
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« Reply #7213 on: December 15, 2013, 07:23:26 PM »
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I can t imagine the highest general ordering maya or kudou to do something for the military the way they want... However it happens with lina and everyone in the usa.

And If the 10 clans found out every one of tatsuya powers they would have to kill him. With elemental sight his magic should have an infinit range and with trident spell he would simply kill anyone anywhere without a way of defense.

Ps. If he doesn t have an infinit range, with the yotsuba resources and his cad genious he just needs to do a third eye but for the trident spell
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« Reply #7212 on: December 15, 2013, 07:08:54 PM »
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It's not a foolish system. The problem is Tatsuya is so powerful that coupled with the existing power of the Yotsuba, it essentially broke the system as there wasn't really anyone that could hold them in check.

Not really.
Yotsuba grow too strong even without Miyuki and Tatsuya.

The check and balances can't do anything about it.

Yotsuba grow too strong, so the other need to weaken yotsuba ?

That's weird logic.

If someone grow strong, everyone need to learn and grow stronger too.

Weaken the other because they're stronger than you is simply Foolish.



I meant that the prime minister or whoever decides that he wants the great asian aliance destroied. Then the magicians decide how to destroy it.
In the usna even the top magician has to obey how non magical people organise an operation. Like lina and the woman colonel or what ever she was ( don t rember the name).
In japan we haven t seen a situation like that.

That's the INDEPENDENT 101  batalion.

Not every magician in japan join them.

Also that doesn't change the fact magician status is lower than Non-magician.
Except the Magician can be a Prime Minister.
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« Reply #7211 on: December 15, 2013, 06:53:39 PM »
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I meant that the prime minister or whoever decides that he wants the great asian aliance destroied. Then the magicians decide how to destroy it.
In the usna even the top magician has to obey how non magical people organise an operation. Like lina and the woman colonel or what ever she was ( don t rember the name).
In japan we haven t seen a situation like that.
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« Reply #7210 on: December 15, 2013, 06:47:13 PM »
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What the hell are you talking about ?
So the Prime minister of Japan can't do anything to the magician ? They're super human and the Prime Minister fear them ?

Magician join military, military is under the Prime minister ? Magician is not anyone's lackey ?

Itsuwa Mio can reject any order from the country ?
No no no, she can't.

Very very weird.
I'm questioning the Structure of power you describe.


Yeah The Ten Master Clan system will be destroyed soon after they know tatsuya power.

What a Foolish System.

It's not a foolish system. The problem is Tatsuya is so powerful that coupled with the existing power of the Yotsuba, it essentially broke the system as there wasn't really anyone that could hold them in check.
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« Reply #7209 on: December 15, 2013, 05:45:29 PM »
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In the usna the sirius is a lackey of a bunch of people that aren t even magicians. How can you organize a operation involving vários magicians If You don t understand magic?
At least with the japanese sistem magicians order other magicians to do stuf, though the clans sistem is bulshit and is starting to fail due to the yotsuba strenght and the other clans might be starting a magician clans fight...

What the hell are you talking about ?
So the Prime minister of Japan can't do anything to the magician ? They're super human and the Prime Minister fear them ?

Magician join military, military is under the Prime minister ? Magician is not anyone's lackey ?

Itsuwa Mio can reject any order from the country ?
No no no, she can't.

Very very weird.
I'm questioning the Structure of power you describe.


Yeah The Ten Master Clan system will be destroyed soon after they know tatsuya power.

What a Foolish System.
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« Reply #7208 on: December 15, 2013, 05:35:25 PM »
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It's been 24 hours but still no new chapter !!!
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« Reply #7207 on: December 15, 2013, 05:32:20 PM »
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In the usna the sirius is a lackey of a bunch of people that aren t even magicians. How can you organize a operation involving vários magicians If You don t understand magic?
At least with the japanese sistem magicians order other magicians to do stuf, though the clans sistem is bulshit and is starting to fail due to the yotsuba strenght and the other clans might be starting a magician clans fight...
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« Reply #7206 on: December 15, 2013, 03:58:07 PM »
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See, this here is what I'm talking about is so surprising. I actually just pointed out where Kudo has twice personally taken direct action against the Yotsuba and yet people still gloss over his actions and focus only on Koichi. If there weren't 2 vamps sealed in v11, there would of actually been a fight between the Yotsuba and Kudo. Koichi said he won't intervene in Maki's plans in v12. Kudo then agreed he won't intervene in those same plans. Their actions are the same. I even pointed to the chapter where the Yotsuba even mention Kudo is involved. I feel like I'm in some corrupt police force where everyone else is being bribed by Kudo except me. Snap out of it people. How could you guys give in so easily to corruption.

Yeah because Kudou made me believe that Yotsuba is very dangerous.

They're too mysterious.
You fear if your neighbour are Terorist.

I try to view the situation from Kudou POV, from Koichi POV.
If I'm in their situation, I will do the same what Kudou do.

Koichi's action is more because hatred from the humiliation in the past.
Kudou's action is because he worries Yotsuba will dictate the country, their country's fate is in Yotsuba's hand.

Someone need to stop them before they are going too far.


Yeah I think this Ten Master Clan system is a BIG Bulshit.
They should adopt USNA system, their system is much bettter and more make sense.
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« Reply #7205 on: December 15, 2013, 03:14:22 PM »
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Shippou is quite understandable. He wants to show everyone he is the strongest magician around by having fights with people from the 18 or 10 clans (the strongest magicians) and use people like Mali or honoka (lol) to give him political support. And he basically ignores anyone who doesn t belong to that criteria.

Koichi is the one who is risking his country for petty reasons. it is obvious that maki wants to deminish the number of militar magicians in japan with a pretty and smiling future so that organisations like blanche with less magical development can become a world menace, because the will continue to increase their militair power!!!

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« Reply #7204 on: December 15, 2013, 02:39:12 PM »
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Quote from: Monstratboy
See, this here is what I'm talking about is so surprising. I actually just pointed out where Kudo has twice personally taken direct action against the Yotsuba and yet people still gloss over his actions and focus only on Koichi. If there weren't 2 vamps sealed in v11, there would of actually been a fight between the Yotsuba and Kudo. Koichi said he won't intervene in Maki's plans in v12. Kudo then agreed he won't intervene in those same plans. Their actions are the same. I even pointed to the chapter where the Yotsuba even mention Kudo is involved. I feel like I'm in some corrupt police force where everyone else is being bribed by Kudo except me. Snap out of it people. How could you guys give in so easily to corruption.

lol, I do remember the events from volume 11 and it would have definitely turned out badly if there was only one parasite. But the reason Kudou intervened at all was because he was personally interested in getting his hands on one, even if the other clan was not the Yotsuba he still would have wanted the parasite, so this event didn't really have anything to do with weakening the Yotsuba.

Quote from: Monstratboy
Tatsuya actually states this was not likely the case and that Maya got the info about Koichi and Kudo somehow(likely Hliðskjálf) and gave it to them. What the Kuroba's found out was the plans of the anti-magic faction.

It is still true that at the end of the day, the information was found in-house, the Yotsuba are just that good and Koichi should've known better.

[quote author="The conversation Tats has with Kazuma in Volume 3 actually confirms if the relationship got out in public that's what would happen though. He is very much under-aged. His relationship to the secretive 101st Battalion is no way essential, since as a member of the 10 Master Clan he is already a military asset and could have been given a military appointment after graduating school like his counterpart Itsuwa."][/quote]

Hum, that would be really weird for the army to just ignore Tatsuya, the guy can nuke entire cities and probably even countries and turn them into dust, I would've thought this would be considered an exceptional situation.
But at the end of the day, Koichi's plan is too risky and the reward isn't worth it.

Quote from: Monstratboy
Chapter 3 actually explains pretty clearly his aim is to build social support in magician circles using Maki's popularity as an actress. For Takuma this helps toward gaining influence in preparation for the Master Clan selection. And while he maybe be hotheaded, have an irrational hatred for the Saegusa and their backers(the Shibas), and inexperienced, he is actually extremely talented in magic. He's impressive enough to be able to match the Saegusa twins and be scouted by the 101st.

I understand that he wants more support, but the fact of the matter is, becoming one of the top 10 clans isn't something so easy that he can easily do it with such a half-assed plan, it takes having incredible clan members or something extremely valuable like possessing a Strategic-Class magician to become one of them, his plan might better the standing of the Shippou but it won't be nowhere near being good enough, it would have been a much better idea to try and strength his clan from the inside rather than what he is doing right now.
Now that you mentioned, I wonder when the selection of the top 10 clans happens and how are they selected.
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« Reply #7203 on: December 15, 2013, 02:22:35 PM »
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First off, does anybody know when exactly the next volume of the series is going to be released ? I only know it's in 2014 but I can't find the month.

To be honest I find the Double Seven arcs to be the most confusing one out of all, with every other arc the goal was kind of obvious and everyone's actions made sense.
In this arc, we have Takuma who is teaming up with Maki and his plan is probably to show that his clan is worthy of being an equal to the 10 clans that are holding the title. And I really don't see how he is planning on doing so, I mean he's just one guy with above average magic power and not that bright, he's teaming up with some actress, how the hell is this going to achieve his purpose ? Especially since I don't think he wants to take any terrorist or anti-magic actions, he seems to one of those dumb people who just want something and doesn't really want to hurt anyone.

That was pretty much the point as Minami pointed out. He was a rabid dog that believed he HAD to be the strongest. Shippou wasn't thinking rationally and he was just being manipulated.

Then we have Maki and her family, from what I understood so far they want to be friends with the magicians so they can gain more influence and power, that's what they want.
Kudou does want to weaken the Yotsuba and when Koichi asked him for his opinion he just said that he won't do anything to interfere with it, so this way he keeps his hands clean no matter what happens, his clan will be safe from the Yotsuba's wrath.
The character I understand the least is Koichi, he said that the Yotsuba are already an entity that surpasses the 10 Master Clans, so he must realize how careful he needs to be when dealing with them, and yet his plan seems very idiotic to me. He's relying on the likes of Maki, someone who is not trustworthy at all, his plan was so stupid that it was easily intercepted by the Kuroba and his idea of weaken the clan is by forcing the 101 battalion to cut off any relationship they have with them by using the media, a plan that has 0 chance of every succeeding.

He's not relying on Maki for anything. In fact, he's not doing anything. He's just letting them get away with their plan. Also, the Kuroba were only able to find out about his plot because of Maya, wh we know is a Sage and has access to Hliðskjálf. There's no hiding anything from her.

Now I don't know if he is aware of the exact relationship between the two parties but if he doesn't then it's really stupid to come up with a plan with so little information, and if he does in fact know that the only reason there is a relationship at all between them is because of Tatsuya, who is literally being lent to the army, and the Yotsuba are not really getting anything in return from this relationship, and if he knows this then he must also know that no matter what the media says or does the army will just find another way to keep Tatsuya with them, the guy is the ultimate strategic-class magician, there is no way they're going to be all " we'll we got caught, so let's leave Tatsuya alone when he's our country's best magical asset". Either way the plan is full of holes, to think Koichi is a clan head of one of the 10 master clans..
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« Reply #7202 on: December 15, 2013, 02:06:53 PM »
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I think Kodou's simply worried about the methods Koichi is using, just like the Jumonjiis are. He wants to see the Yotsuba weakened, not an outright conflict between the two strongest families of the Ten Master Clans.
Kudou does want to weaken the Yotsuba and when Koichi asked him for his opinion he just said that he won't do anything to interfere with it, so this way he keeps his hands clean no matter what happens, his clan will be safe from the Yotsuba's wrath.
See, this here is what I'm talking about is so surprising. I actually just pointed out where Kudo has twice personally taken direct action against the Yotsuba and yet people still gloss over his actions and focus only on Koichi. If there weren't 2 vamps sealed in v11, there would of actually been a fight between the Yotsuba and Kudo. Koichi said he won't intervene in Maki's plans in v12. Kudo then agreed he won't intervene in those same plans. Their actions are the same. I even pointed to the chapter where the Yotsuba even mention Kudo is involved. I feel like I'm in some corrupt police force where everyone else is being bribed by Kudo except me. Snap out of it people. How could you guys give in so easily to corruption.

In this arc, we have Takuma who is teaming up with Maki and his plan is probably to show that his clan is worthy of being an equal to the 10 clans that are holding the title. And I really don't see how he is planning on doing so, I mean he's just one guy with above average magic power and not that bright, he's teaming up with some actress, how the hell is this going to achieve his purpose ? Especially since I don't think he wants to take any terrorist or anti-magic actions, he seems to one of those dumb people who just want something and doesn't really want to hurt anyone.
Chapter 3 actually explains pretty clearly his aim is to build social support in magician circles using Maki's popularity as an actress. For Takuma this helps toward gaining influence in preparation for the Master Clan selection. And while he maybe be hotheaded, have an irrational hatred for the Saegusa and their backers(the Shibas), and inexperienced, he is actually extremely talented in magic. He's impressive enough to be able to match the Saegusa twins and be scouted by the 101st.

Then we have Maki and her family, from what I understood so far they want to be friends with the magicians so they can gain more influence and power, that's what they want.
Their goal is more related to after building connections within the magic community, to initiate reorganisation and give magicians different roles that would see magic used to support their way of life rather than it being primarily a military aspect. Maki calls it a plan for a new order in c8. Koichi calls it them being manipulated by foreign anti-magic elements.

He's relying on the likes of Maki, someone who is not trustworthy at all,
He's not relying on her for anything. The anti magic faction, media and politicians were carrying out their plot already. Maki only asked him to not interfere. Both Kudo and Koich think its ok for this to go ahead and that it will work our in the favour of the magician community in the end. The next chapter will go into more detail about it. In addition to this they are scheming against the Yotsuba.

his plan was so stupid that it was easily intercepted by the Kuroba
Tatsuya actually states this was not likely the case and that Maya got the info about Koichi and Kudo somehow(likely Hliðskjálf) and gave it to them. What the Kuroba's found out was the plans of the anti-magic faction.

his idea of weaken the clan is by forcing the 101 battalion to cut off any relationship they have with them by using the media, a plan that has 0 chance of every succeeding.
The conversation Tats has with Kazuma in Volume 3 actually confirms if the relationship got out in public that's what would happen though. He is very much under-aged. His relationship to the secretive 101st Battalion is no way essential, since as a member of the 10 Master Clan he is already a military asset and could have been given a military appointment after graduating school like his counterpart Itsuwa.
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« Reply #7201 on: December 15, 2013, 01:31:12 PM »
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when they speak of saegusa and yotsuba its magical muscle power... still why they are regarded as more powerfull than a clan with a acknowlegde stratigic class magician i dont know

If the clan with an acknowledged strategic class magician you're referring to is the Itsuwa Clan; then the reason is because without Mio (the magician in question), the rest of the clan is nothing special. The entire reason they're even considered one of the Ten Master Clans is because of Mio, without her, they'd be tossed right back out. That's also the reason every single other Ten Master Clan is considered more powerful. The Itsuwa's Clan power is too unstable (Mio could drop dead any minute).
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« Reply #7200 on: December 15, 2013, 01:20:48 PM »
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it is not the kudou clan which is powerfull it is kudou-shogun, and it is probaly mostly political, and influence as an elder

when they speak of saegusa and yotsuba its magical muscle power... still why they are regarded as more powerfull than a clan with a acknowlegde stratigic class magician i dont know
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« Reply #7199 on: December 15, 2013, 12:06:38 PM »
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First off, does anybody know when exactly the next volume of the series is going to be released ? I only know it's in 2014 but I can't find the month.

To be honest I find the Double Seven arcs to be the most confusing one out of all, with every other arc the goal was kind of obvious and everyone's actions made sense.
In this arc, we have Takuma who is teaming up with Maki and his plan is probably to show that his clan is worthy of being an equal to the 10 clans that are holding the title. And I really don't see how he is planning on doing so, I mean he's just one guy with above average magic power and not that bright, he's teaming up with some actress, how the hell is this going to achieve his purpose ? Especially since I don't think he wants to take any terrorist or anti-magic actions, he seems to one of those dumb people who just want something and doesn't really want to hurt anyone.
Then we have Maki and her family, from what I understood so far they want to be friends with the magicians so they can gain more influence and power, that's what they want.
Kudou does want to weaken the Yotsuba and when Koichi asked him for his opinion he just said that he won't do anything to interfere with it, so this way he keeps his hands clean no matter what happens, his clan will be safe from the Yotsuba's wrath.
The character I understand the least is Koichi, he said that the Yotsuba are already an entity that surpasses the 10 Master Clans, so he must realize how careful he needs to be when dealing with them, and yet his plan seems very idiotic to me. He's relying on the likes of Maki, someone who is not trustworthy at all, his plan was so stupid that it was easily intercepted by the Kuroba and his idea of weaken the clan is by forcing the 101 battalion to cut off any relationship they have with them by using the media, a plan that has 0 chance of every succeeding.
Now I don't know if he is aware of the exact relationship between the two parties but if he doesn't then it's really stupid to come up with a plan with so little information, and if he does in fact know that the only reason there is a relationship at all between them is because of Tatsuya, who is literally being lent to the army, and the Yotsuba are not really getting anything in return from this relationship, and if he knows this then he must also know that no matter what the media says or does the army will just find another way to keep Tatsuya with them, the guy is the ultimate strategic-class magician, there is no way they're going to be all " we'll we got caught, so let's leave Tatsuya alone when he's our country's best magical asset". Either way the plan is full of holes, to think Koichi is a clan head of one of the 10 master clans..
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« Reply #7198 on: December 15, 2013, 11:47:42 AM »
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What I previously posted is what I believe. Kudo tried to get Kazuma to help him weaken the Yotsuba and then also sent underlings to capture the vamps, the same actions Koichi took. But surprisingly most of the forum discussions I've seen have been ignoring Kudo's actions and only focusing on Saegusa vs Yotsuba, when it should be Kudo +Saegusa vs Yotsuba as seen mentioned in v12c9 and I do not believe Kudo's comments about Koichi in v11.
I think Kodou's simply worried about the methods Koichi is using, just like the Jumonjiis are. He wants to see the Yotsuba weakened, not an outright conflict between the two strongest families of the Ten Master Clans.

Quote
Sorry I didn't cover my point properly, Kudo's statement about Koichi showing interest in the vamps only after Maya did is not chronologically accurate. The Sagaesua clan's members were murdered several weeks before Maya displayed any notable interest. That interest being the actions they noted the Kuroba's taking.
     Again, this is only my interpretation, but I believe the author meant to express that Koichi only intensified his his personal interest(not as the head of the Saegusa, but Saegusa Koichi the man) after the Yotsuba became involved.
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« Reply #7197 on: December 15, 2013, 11:18:31 AM »
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So, you think this Ten Master Clan system and the Check and Balances is Bulshit ?
Everyone wants to be the Strongest ?
Not because they fear other family will dictate the country ?
What I previously posted is what I believe. Kudo tried to get Kazuma to help him weaken the Yotsuba and then also sent underlings to capture the vamps, the same actions Koichi took. But surprisingly most of the forum discussions I've seen have been ignoring Kudo's actions and only focusing on Saegusa vs Yotsuba, when it should be Kudo +Saegusa vs Yotsuba as seen mentioned in v12c9 and I do not believe Kudo's comments about Koichi in v11.

I'm pretty sure that was the reason that Koichi gave his daughter when he asked her to represent the clan in the matter. However, what Mayumi was doing (representing the official Saegusa response), and what Koichi was doing (acting in his personal interests) should be separated. It's not like Mayumi especially trusts her father when this kind of thing happens, as we saw from the SS.
Sorry I didn't cover my point properly, Kudo's statement about Koichi showing interest in the vamps only after Maya did is not chronologically accurate. The Sagaesua clan's members were murdered several weeks before Maya displayed any notable interest. That interest being the actions they noted the Kuroba's taking.
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« Reply #7196 on: December 15, 2013, 09:56:36 AM »
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Quote from: Ultragunner
The house of the sibling is pretty big :heh:

DAT chibi Miyuki :love:


Madhouse is pulling out all the stops for this one. I think its safe to say that we can expect a decent show animation-wise.
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« Reply #7195 on: December 15, 2013, 09:10:29 AM »
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Gonna be the longest four months ever.
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« Reply #7194 on: December 15, 2013, 07:42:24 AM »
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are u saying dat she feels nothing? . Though her memories were converted to knowledge, there is no mention of her losing all feelings in the process. even if she is same as tats[well 90%-since he feels for his sister],  i dont think u would bet on her feeling nothing against them when she lost everything becoz of dat- father, relationship with miya , love of her life koichi and 29 members of the yotsuba..So if u think there will be no fireworks..hmmmm

After Miya changed Maya's memories from experiential to informational, Maya lost her emotional attachment to her father, Mia, Koichi, and everyone she'd ever known up to that time. Since she has no emotional investment in them, any resentment she might harbor toward Dahan would be based on the knowledge of the torture she'd undergone and the knowledge of the loss of her "family" and "loved ones." But because it's only based on abstract knowledge, her feelings likely max out at resentment and not reach hatred.

Regarding Maya's emotional condition, as far as I know there's no textev to indicate that she doesn't have feelings. Any experiences she had after Miya operated on her should be stored as experiential memory, laden with whatever emotions she'd felt at that time.
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Hakazee
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« Reply #7193 on: December 15, 2013, 02:36:09 AM »
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   My opinion: Of course each of the Ten want to be the strongest. At the same time, they don't want another family to be the strongest. Hence if one family becomes too strong, the others will gang up against it. That's how the checks and balance system works.


So, if one family become too strong the other will weaken them ?

The system is weird.
Why not share their power, so their power will be equal and balance.

Maybe through marriage or others.
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« Reply #7192 on: December 15, 2013, 02:35:02 AM »
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are u saying dat she feels nothing? . Though her memories were converted to knowledge, there is no mention of her losing all feelings in the process. even if she is same as tats[well 90%-since he feels for his sister],  i dont think u would bet on her feeling nothing against them when she lost everything becoz of dat- father, relationship with miya , love of her life koichi and 29 members of the yotsuba..So if u think there will be no fireworks..hmmmm
Well this is the best way I can put it, when Maya was 12, Miya was forced by their father to wipe her memories but since she couldn't do it he told her to take out the feelings. So Maya's mental facilities were permanently restructured to take out the emotions from all her memories/experiences. So I really don't know, if she has emotions which I think she does since she hated Miya for what she had done.
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